Any guess on the hybrid GX arrival time frame? Lexus has promised a hybrid variant at a later date. The best guess, from viewing a Lexus PR video, is the drivetrain will be as in the Toyota Land Cruiser, the 2.4L Hybrid Max., result in much better fuel economy than the soon to arrive V6.
Any guess on the hybrid?
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Should I feel guilty if I buy a 2024 ICE vehicle? Kinda torn now.
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In my view there are several considerations:
Yes, hybrid vehicles are the big sellers now and the foreseeable future, but battery technology/chemistry/electronics is rapidly changing. Be honest though, the hybrid revolution is all about manufacturers meeting federal requirements for MPG and emissions.
Will my GX be a "keeper", past any warranty, including the battery, and will the battery technology in my GX by then be completely obsolete? Parts available, etc.? I have this uneasy feeling the manufacturers love hybrids, as keepers will be a thing of the past.
However, it is a given the hybrid version will be much more frugal with fuel, probably my guesstimate 27 vs 18 MPG.
It is also known the GX hybrid will employ the turbo 4, same as in the Tacoma, versus the smooth V6. However, hybrids do tend to smooth out a 4-cylinder, "filling in the gaps" with the electric motor.
As in the Land Cruiser, will being a hybrid preclude the availability of a 3rd-row, where the battery resides? Notice the Overtrail trims offer no 3rd-row.
As I understand it, and could be incorrect, the Tacoma (and Tundra) hybrid drivetrain does not use a torque converter, but a wet clutch. Can we trust this system to be durable? Essentially unproven.
Last, but certainly not least, just a guess, but some sources indicate it will probably be 2025 before the hybrid GX becomes available. Do I wish to wait? This somewhat motivates me to look at the Land Cruiser, but cannot develop a like for it.
We are having similar thoughts. I do believe that in a few short years, technolgy will rapidly progress. Solid state batteries, hydrogen power, etc. I think the current (2024) V6 twin turbo would be an awesome last ICE engine to own. Lots to think about though.
The 3-row GX’s also lose some floor depth to host the seats. Looks similar to the higher lift over of the LC with the battery storage needs. Imagine if you wanted a 3rd row AND a hybrid! Untenable at this point. I suspect the V6 hybrid (Tundra/Sequoia) will find its’ way into the LX while the 4-cylinder will show in the GX (GX400h??). I really like the hybrid drivetrain smoothness of the Defender, but reliability and cost are big negatives for me. Without solid axels or body or frame, it can hide more things. I can live with a 5 seater and prefer the extra space, lower weight, and lower load floor. It does NOT hurt that my back yard is a great off road area where the OT+ can showcase its’ talents
I'm personally happy I'm getting the non hybrid GX. I know that I should follow the advice and not buy a first year model car ( I got burned doing this in 2018 with a Gen 3 coyote F-150), but with the current trend of dealer markups and little availability on this sought after truck, I think it would be wise to get in when you can.
I worked at a Japanese shop when I was in my teens and most of our revenue came from replacing Prius batteries. It was shocking to see how much the costs for the battery plus labor was for these cars out of warranty. I don't know if it merits the savings from higher mpg to when you have to pay out of pocket for a replacement battery.
Granted Toyota/Lexus are generally reliable and less complex in their designs than their European and American counterparts, and that's for good measure; serviceability, reliability, lower cost of ownership.
Look at the v6 in the Siennas. Those were workhorses of an engine. Now they are replaced with a Hybrid 4 banger. Its still a great car. My uncle has one. But god forbid how much the service will be out of warranty when he needs a new battery.
I have a Tesla as my primary car right now, so I'm for one telling you that its great savings when you're in warranty, but I will have to decide long and hard after my 8 years are up if this will be something I keep. The GX550 for example, would be on track for a 20+ year vehicle for my needs. I need it to be reliable and not break the bank.
Sure you can argue that the new power-plant has had diabolical issues in the Tundra, even bricking a lot of them even when they are still on the dealer lots. But I'm putting all my eggs in the Tahara plant "basket" and hoping that assemblies there are more reliable and well made compared to the US plants. I know they source the engine from US plants, but same goes for the Type R. Hoping for the best.
I'm not afraid of the forced induction, It should be more efficient and powerful in day to day applications.
Hope this ramble made some sense for those who are unsure about going Hybrid or not.
I worked at a Japanese shop when I was in my teens and most of our revenue came from replacing Prius batteries. It was shocking to see how much the costs for the battery plus labor was for these cars out of warranty. I don't know if it merits the savings from higher mpg to when you have to pay out of pocket for a replacement battery.
Granted Toyota/Lexus are generally reliable and less complex in their designs than their European and American counterparts, and that's for good measure; serviceability, reliability, lower cost of ownership.
Look at the v6 in the Siennas. Those were workhorses of an engine. Now they are replaced with a Hybrid 4 banger. Its still a great car. My uncle has one. But god forbid how much the service will be out of warranty when he needs a new battery.
I have a Tesla as my primary car right now, so I'm for one telling you that its great savings when you're in warranty, but I will have to decide long and hard after my 8 years are up if this will be something I keep. The GX550 for example, would be on track for a 20+ year vehicle for my needs. I need it to be reliable and not break the bank.
Sure you can argue that the new power-plant has had diabolical issues in the Tundra, even bricking a lot of them even when they are still on the dealer lots. But I'm putting all my eggs in the Tahara plant "basket" and hoping that assemblies there are more reliable and well made compared to the US plants. I know they source the engine from US plants, but same goes for the Type R. Hoping for the best.
I'm not afraid of the forced induction, It should be more efficient and powerful in day to day applications.
Hope this ramble made some sense for those who are unsure about going Hybrid or not.
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- #8
I personally think it will most likely be a long-term wash cost wise between hybrid vs non-hybrid. And, as you, will be a "keeper" for me. I envision battery chemistry being markedly different in a decade, so another reason to go non-hybrid. As far as the issues with the Tundra mill, primarily the wastegate, correct? That has been solved, and they are now supplied from a different vendor. Another consideration, the Tundra is American designed and manufactured, but the GX will come from the renowned Tahara plant. A win-win from my viewpoint. Turbo's? Well, in this regard a lot to be said for prudent operation. Had a Subaru turbo many years ago, and no issues. Always drove gently at start-up, and definitely a cool-down before shut-down when pushing it hard.
Yeah I think we share similar views when it comes to this topic. I think turbo engines behaviors are more reliant on their transmission pairings tbh. My old gti with the dct was a fantasic combo. Other econobox offerings weren't the same case. I had a 10 speed in my F-150, and it was ok. I'm not sure who supplies the 10 speed for the GX. Is it Aisin? If so then I would feel better about it.
And before the dense minded chime in and say " if you want less moving parts and reliability just get the previous gen" I Say to you, that for my needs I would prefer a new vehicle because of its complexity and overhaul in technology. I need something that will be relevant inside the cabin twenty years from now. Lexus current MMI works great and is as invasive as I would like it to be. Sure there is the risk of the infotainment failing, and I know you can swap mmi to an aftermarket brand in 2020- GXs, but I think this is a sweet spot in their segment and am feeling positive about it.
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- #10
Yes, as I understand it, an Aisin tranny in the GX. However, the Aisin 8-speed did have some minor teething issues, but unable to dig up any negatives re the 10-speed. Speaking of the VW DSG/DCT, had it in a Passat, and a great transmission.
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